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File: 141225093205.jpg (157.43 KB, 800x695, mlfw7660.jpg)

Anonymous 36780260

Celestia
Goddess, normal pony (as normal as alicorns can be), or anything in-between?

How should she act like among the commonfolk? should there be a 'church of Celestia' or something? Do ponies pray to her?

discuss

Anonymous 36780264

Eh. Celestia doesn't matter anymore.
Thanks McCarthy.

Nº 441 !fOINzMA0KU 36780275

>>36780260
She's a normal pony. Period.

>How should she act like among the commonfolk?
However she pleases... Although I doubt that she has much autonomy in that, due to the fact that she has to keep appearances in order to keep the country trust in her so that she can keep it ticking smoothly.

She's more of a servant than a ruler sometimes.

Geldon 36780290

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>>36780260
>Goddess, normal pony (as normal as alicorns can be), or anything in-between?
Well, she's lived for over 1,000 years and raises the sun every morning and lowers it every night. I think calling her a straight up normal pony at that point would be a little naive. But I'm not thinking, "Goddess," just an exceptionally magical example of an already magical race. Demigoddess? Why not.

>How should she act like among the commonfolk? should there be a 'church of Celestia' or something?
She's already doing it. She's not just their leader, she's sort of a maternal figure as well. If you think about it, she's sort of a gender-flipped Papa Smurf, but with more aplomb because she runs a proper kingdom instead of just a village.

>Do ponies pray to her?
Apparently so considering, "By Celestia!" and "Celestia Help Me!" are examples canonical dialogue, or something like those.

Granted, that's probably in the same connotation that someone might say, "By George," so maybe it's based on the idea of monarchs having a spark of the divine... it's just a little more literal in the case of a monarch that raises the sun every morning.

Last edited at Thu, Oct 2nd, 2014 11:13

Anonymous 36780292

File: 141227412399.png (100.82 KB, 643x837, 139574567212.png)

>>36780290
>raises and lowers the sun
Very normal unicorns did that before her though, she just happens to be good at it.

>"By Celestia!" and "Celestia Help Me!" are examples canonical dialogue
right, i expected those quotes to show up as soon as i hit reply.

Mondo!peSTIcIDes 36780293

File: 141227551541.png (49.37 KB, 543x404, I didn't realize you were…)

I definitely wouldn't consider her a goddess. Her supposed immortality aside, she isn't even actually that powerful compared to any number of other ponies. Does she deserve adoration? Perhaps, as she seems to be a pretty great leader. But worship? A church? Definitely not.

Unlikeable Pony (element of being banned. again) 36780297

File: 141227614097.jpg (275.75 KB, 1400x828, Untitled.jpg)

Definitely Greek god level goddess.

She watches over a fundamental aspect of the universe effortlessly, when it took a cabal of the most powerful Wizards in the world previously to do the job, and that task would BREAK them, leaving them robbed of all their magic.

On the other hand, Celestia apparently draws energy from her task, meaning that she's basically merged with her domain a bit.
Likewise, ponies revere her and use her name in the same manner a person would us a deity (as stated above).




Now, as for why ponies don't worship her like you would expect a goddess?
According to the comics they DID. celestia and luna used to be seen as much, much higher than your mortal ponies in the past: However, After Luna had her giant freak out, Celestia had a bit of a realization that her cultivating an atmosphere of Reverence was a huge part of Luna's fall, and set about to make sure the ponies no longer feared her as a goddess but saw her as "one of them".


Ergo, I think she's very much a goddess, just she's essentially trying to tell ponies "Being more powerful than someone else doesn't mean you need to fear and worship them", akin to how there are tons of entities in Startrek that would qualify as gods, but humans refuse to worship them.

Nother Nonymous (Element of Threadkilling) 36780304

File: 141227787937.png (2.99 MB, 2762x3852, Alicorn.png)

>>36780297
The problem is that "god" doesn't mean anything definite. We're clearly not talking capital-G God -- omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, undying, atemporal, the necessarily existing Ground of All Being, Alpha and Omega, amen. On the other hand, Celestia is clearly a step up from deified Roman emperors like Augustus and Claudius. Unlike them, she is immortal in the flesh, at least in the sense of never growing old; and she has all sorts of supernatural powers, including controlling the heavens. There's not much question in my mind that if you had dropped her into the Athenian agora in 450 B.C., she would have been worshipped -- possibly with a nod to these lines of the pre-Socratic philosopher Xenophanes:

But if cattle and horses and lions had hands
Or could paint with their hands and create works as men do,
Horses like horses and cattle like cattle
Would depict the gods' shapes and make their bodies
Of such a sort as the form they themselves have...

Last edited at Thu, Oct 2nd, 2014 12:25

Nº 441 !fOINzMA0KU 36780310

>>36780304
So what you're saying is that Celestia is Horse god?

I refute that claim in grounds that Celestia is too good to be only god for horses. She's better than all gods, Including God, because she's not a Mary Sue. (WATCH OUT DON'T CUT YOURSELF ON MY EDGE)

Nightmare Knight!M.76e9/nVY 36780321

File: 141229610776.png (484.95 KB, 1024x872, what_is_this_even_a_celestia_d…)

I always hated the alicorns = gods thing, which is apparently an unpopular opinion in this fandom as everyone's headcanon - with rare exceptions - seems to deify them.

I don't think there would be a "Church of Celestia", at least not one that she approved of. Doesn't seem in line with her personality on the show.

Nother Nonymous (Element of Threadkilling) 36780333

File: 141230099271.jpg (57.93 KB, 504x316, By Celestia's.jpg)

>>36780321
A lot of minor Greco-Roman gods and goddesses didn't have temples or cults, especially those of a rural character. Pan, for example, or Priapus. The worship was informal; a murmured prayer at a backyard shrine, a splash of wine, a few flowers...

Unlikeable Pony (element of being banned. again) 36780372

File: 141231056625.png (454.84 KB, 680x680, Fausticooon.png)

>>36780321

I think it works; Honestly, a "Good" god that was truly interested in the well being of those it seeks to protect wouldn't give a shit about worship; what good does that do to anyone? That's like someone demanding you constantly kiss their ass before they'll help you.


So celestia NOT trying to set up a cult for herself makes sense to me, as that's what I'd see a Good entity doing: it wouldn't seek to force worship, though it also wouldn't try to seek out and murder people who tried to respect it via using their name or praying to them: they'd have that right.

Heck, the fact that worship really seems Egotistical is one big reason why Most works use the "God needs prayer badly" thing, since it excuses more benevolent ones having huge churches and the like.

Crimson Risk !RISkQqf4EM 36780669

File: 141250054626.png (89.7 KB, 125x114, 130619193848.png)

Goddess!

Nother Nonymous (Element of Threadkilling) 36780672

File: 141250608309.jpg (115.07 KB, 658x1311, hoofkissy.jpg)

>>36780669
All the prostration and hoofkissing seems pretty close to worship. It ain't just a polite bow and a curtsey.

DemonioBlanco 36780676

>>36780372
Funny thing that applejack lies.

because Faust dont watch over them at all.

Anonymous 36780677

File: 141252117808.png (322.37 KB, 2800x2800, 89841.png)

>>36780676
You gotta believe, man
believe Faust is still there, watching over us
watching with us

Nother Nonymous (Element of Threadkilling) 36780764

File: 141261254735.jpg (157.03 KB, 660x1060, Gulliver_hoofkiss.jpg)

>>36780684
Hooves aren't hands. When Celestia's forehoof stays on or near the ground, the hoofkisser must abase him or herself to kiss it. This makes it analogous to kissing a human's feet, not hands.

Like much else in Equestria, this issue was dealt with in Book IV of Gulliver's Travels:

"But as I was going to prostrate myself to kiss his Hoof, he did me the Honour to raise it gently to my Mouth. I am not ignorant how much I have been censured for mentioning this last Particular. For my Detractors are pleased to think it improbable, that so Illustrious a Person should descend to give so great a Mark of Distinction to a Creature so inferior as I."

Anonymous 36780778

>>36780764
Except there's a difference between fore-hooves and hind-hooves.
Since ponies don't possess hands, the fore-hooves must be analogous. If ponies were to kiss Celestia's "feet" they would be awkwardly trying to get at her hind-hooves. I'd love to see that, personally, for just how hilarious it would look.

Geldon 36780789

File: 141261802791.png (184.83 KB, 304x321, wtf am I reading.png)

>Everypony bows when she enters the room
>"Come on guise, it doesn't mean anything when they kiss her hoof, she's just as normal pony like everypony else."

Anonymous 36780790

>>36780789
Well, she's obviously important. Otherwise people wouldn't be flipping their shit when she was abducted in the season 4 premiere.

!dmE/Zk0X6M 36780805

>>36780790

That could just be MWWS, though.

Anonymous 36780808

>>36780805
MerriWether Williams Syndrome?

Anonymous 36780810

>>36780808
She didn't write that episode. :p
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Missing_white_woman_syndrome

Anonymous 36780811

>>36780810
I thought he was referring to how everyone freaking out over Celestia going missing was OOC or something because Celestia barely does anything other than raise the sun (which it appears Twilight can handle).

Unlikeable Pony (element of being banned. again) 36780817

File: 141264615986.jpg (80.95 KB, 545x403, cel_allstar.jpg)

>>36780790
>>36780805


That had more to do with the fact that night and day were happening AT ONCE when they were captured.

Which I think does a good argument for them being far more than just normal mortals.

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