This week in the FishTank we have two authors who have contributed to the
FT
before. Both of these stories were written for the Anniversary. The
stories
are as different and unique as their author. This second submission is a
complete story by Alexis Siefert. It is 3,760 words in length. A look at
the life of an actress.
FishTank Guidelines apply:
1) 2 positive comments
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
3) Try not to repeat!
FT submissions and comments may be found at:
http://www.asstr.org/~Desdmona/FishTank/base
**************************************************
The View From Inside (MF)
By Alexis Siefert
Postive #Uno->I was 25, and I had three names. Fuck. No wonder I
started
drinking.
I just love that line. It has emotional weight behind it and its funny.
Postive#Dos- Most ingenious use of a fishtank in an anniversary story.
That fishtank means something and I screamed at the ending.
Negative#Uno- She burned the damn fishtank! Maybe I'm a sentimental
fart, but I didn't understand why. It was like she was killing every bit
she had of him.
Negative#Dos-It was a wonderful story about acting, the pressures of
acting and alcohol addiction, but where was the sex? We need more sex!
Heck, I beleive in Nate and Des, let's get it on :)
Shon Richards
A good portion of my stories can be found at my never-finished website at
http://www.asstr.org/~ShonRichards/
All of them can be found through ftp at
http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/ShonRichards/
From: oosh
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 01:59:14 +0000 (UTC)
Two such accomplished stories in one week! To criticize either seems an
impudence. And this one appears far more polished than any first draft of
mine that I can remember!
I'm embarrassed to start with something so trivial, but perhaps both my
"points to improve" are embarrassingly trivial, and I hope that will be
taken as a compliment.
Seeing a dash written as a hyphen-just like this-is to me a big stumbling
block. I read "hyphen-just" and "this-is" as groups. Maybe typographers
don't surround dashes by spaces; but in a plain text medium, I honestly
think we should. Every time I saw a dash, I stumbled and got distracted.
Second on points to reconsider, if not exactly to "improve": I felt that
this piece had excellent sentence rhythm, and the choice of words was
generally irreproachable. But I did feel that it was strait-jacketed by
its avoidance of colons or semi-colons. I don't at all object to full
stops/periods being used instead of lesser stops on occcasion, but for
me, their over-use is jolting. Colons and semi-colons can give the same
spacing without nailing the pace so much. Of course, when one is used to
reading a fuller vocabulary of punctuation, it is harder to accord to the
full stop/period the do-it-all function that others would have it supply,
so perhaps my sensibilities and good taste have been fried by too much
inferior prose.
Finally on the (too many) things to improve, the brick "backing" of the
fire. This was a good and helpful image. Everything here worked, but I
felt that the word "backing" was too weak. "Chimney-back" or "hearth-
back" might be better. Having seen this and picked up on it, I then
noticed that the word "back" occurred twice more in close proximity.
That's a devil, when it happens. I wonder if there's anything that can be
done to reduce those three successive backs. It's the kind of thing that
gives me nightmares, because I know from my own painful experience how
often that kind of thing happens. Maybe I'm being over-sensitive.
The positives are much more significant for me. I was full of admiration
for the way the author built the character of the narrator and insinuated
her doubts and fears. It was a really gripping and convincing tale, and
one that kept me completely involved and interested. While the ending
could be called melodramatic - and if I'd written this tale (or been able
to write it) I'm sure I'd have flagellated myself endlessly about it - I
truly think that the whole level of emotional intensity supports it and
made it convincing for me. Nothing less would really answer the emotional
demands of the story. And those demands were convincingly made. I thought
that to put across a drama of this depth in so short a compass was a
remarkable achievement.
I also felt that the sexual element was beautifully proportioned to the
subject. It was done in a way that I found both grateful and graceful in
itself, and also that highlighted and clarified the characters involved.
I think I came away with more points to improve for myself than for
anyone else! I much admired it.
O.
From: Jeff Zephyr
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 21:51:55 -0600
I liked how the tale explored the inside of Lucy's fall into
addiction. It didn't define her life, but it certainly had a major
impact, in more ways than just the ending.
That's not completely fair. I started drinking long before
I had three names. You can't spend time around actors and
not drink. It's part of the scenery. It's one of your
props. A bottle of champagne on opening night, frozen
cocktails at cast parties after the show closes, beer in the
dressing room after rehearsals, wine during casting
meetings. It was inevitable.
I'd comment on the 3 names line. But that is taken. Instead, the
whole "actor's life" excuse-making is quite well done. It isn't
quite true, BTW. It is the same sort of scenery as the beer for the
factory workers at the bar or picnic, or any adult party pretty much.
Some people, without being either children or recovering, deal with it
better.
But if Lucy was one of those, we would have a different story. So
her take on her situation is a perfect inside view, her inability to
see the problem and let things go feels "right." Makes me wish that I
could be there to help her out, if there was a way to fix things
better.
I'd wish for a different ending. I get what happens, and it hurts
to read about it. The whole tale is like that, I think, but it does
get to a point where I'm really glad it wasn't longer. There'd be
more pain, more feeling of loss if the hot, happy sex and love went on
more.
Still, a 2nd for the wish to make a bit more to the sex parts. The
whole romance has a nice edgey sexiness to it suggested, yet it seems
to fall into the cracks between the work and drinking problems.
Somehow, I just don't think they got married just for love, nor for
just close interests. No, the opening seems to set up a soft romantic
side to things, and the "on the rooftop" stuff seems the design of an
active, maybe even obsessive love life.
Makes me wonder where that went, when they weren't together so much.
Was she missing it? More, how unhappy was Nathan over the whole
situation?
I know, it is her view and not his, but maybe a glimpse, a bit more
of his disappointment (he seems so calm, but I can't see him hiding
all of it, nor her missing all of it).
Jeff
Web site at http://www.asstr.org/~jeffzephyr/
For FTP, ftp://ftp.asstr.org/pub/Authors/jeffzephyr/
There is nothing more important than petting the cat.
From: Bradley Stoke
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 9 Jul 2002 04:37:11 -0700
Alexis
A touching story of love, loss, fame and failure. One which kept a
focus on its essential motif of cocoa, alcohol and mutual support.
There was a lot to like about the story, but as other critics will
have their own favourites, I'll concentrate on just two things (as I
don't want to again be accused of diverging from the FishTank
Guidelines).
My first praise would be for the way the story manages to bring
together the elements of Lydia's relationship with Nathan in a
plausible way in a life which demand a change in his essential role:
from being a student lover, through being a supportive husband, a
concerned manager and, finally, someone who sacrifices everything
(perhaps not intentionally) to help Lydia's declining career.
I also liked the sensual way in which scenes of sex and love were
drawn together and flowed naturally from the rest of the story. It
wasn't forced and it brought some very cozy images to my mind. Wrapped
in a blanket, fucking on a lawn chair, cocoa in front of a fire -
surely no woman could want for a better partner than Nathan? (Although
what does the saintly Nathan get out of this? Do people like him
really walk the Earth? Or do they descend on wings and serve only to
bring broad grins to the already over-stretched faces of Whoopi
Goldberg and Robin Williams?).
However, my biggest gripe, but I've no idea how it can be improved, is
the plausibility of it all. Maybe this is "rom" fiction and maybe this
comfortable world of saintly husbands. Of a thespian career with so
few tantrums and only the slightest hint of a drink problem. Where
only one understudy and not an army of them are working to undermine
Lydia's career. Where a woman can somehow avoid even a hint of
infidelity when that is almost the norm in the world she inhabits. And
where a career in Broadway sounds as straightforward as a career in
Accountancy. Perhaps in the world of "Rom", all this is possible and
real and at the end it all works out so well that only exceptional
circumstances like a badly judged fall down the stairs will really
bring tragedy. I think my problem is that all I know of the catty,
bitchy, deceitful and ruthless world of the stage is merely hinted at
here. It reads to me like someone in "Hello" magazine confessing to a
life that went wrong (for a nice fat fee), who has taken full
advantage of her right to edit the final text. But perhaps I just
misunderstand the genre, and reality as I understand it gets only a
small look-in.
My other suggestion of what to improve. I don't know. It's a
well-structured, well-written, well proof-read story. Only
plausibility and credibility mar it in my mind (and I might just be
very cynical). I guess it might have been good to get more of the
physical sense of what it was like for Lydia to be an actress, and not
just a wife whose job was on Broadway. Perhaps some more mention of
the intrusiveness of the press, a sense of the agony of first-night
nerves, some extra evidence that Lydia's life was one really spent in
the City of New York (where the poodles are so small, the restaurants
are so crowded and the elevators take so long to arrive) and real
evidence that Lydia did really have a drink problem.
Well done. A very well written story.
Bradley Stoke
For More : http://www.asstr.org/~Bradley_Stoke
From: Tesseract
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 9 Jul 2002 23:10:43 -0700
1) 2 positive comments
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
3) Try not to repeat!
It's a very poignant story, and reminiscent of "Days of Wine and
Roses". I think you show the slide into addiction very well and you
keep the melancholy mood going through to the end. I wasn't happy with
the ending, but it was necessary. It was fitting that he died because
of her.
You got the technical stuff - spelling, grammar - right. But I would
expect that. Except for the hypens/dashes. I believe the common
typographic convention is to use two hypens: - , if the character set
you're using doesn't have a proper dash.
<aside>
About semicolons. I assume you are the product of a North American
education, as I am.
I was told about semcolons so that I would recognize one when I saw
it, and had some idea about its function. But I wasn't given much
instruction in actually using them. Actually, I am quite upset about
much of my high school English instruction. It really neglected formal
grammar.
<\aside>
I have a bit of a problem with this section:
I suddenly had urgent calls from my agent to return, and
three casting directors cancelled appointments the next day.
Fucking petty little bitch.
So, I did what any good actress does. I screamed at my
agent's secretary, stormed off the stage, locked the door to
my dressing room, and opened the bottle of wine that was, as
always, chilling in the mini-fridge.
It doesn't really say why she walked off the stage. What was the
triggering event? If it was the actions of the previous paragraph, why
would she walk onto the stage in the first place, instead of sulking
in her dressing room?
But that's just nit-picking. Overall I think it' a good story.
Tesseract
From: Mat Twassel
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 15:41:43 GMT
Strengths:
The sweeping narrative flow - telling a longish history without getting bogged
down, covering ground and keeping it interesting.
The selection of details - from funny pairing of names: Lucy & Des, to the fish
tank castle. It's so neat that she didn't know she didn't have it, and that it
didn't burn in the fire.
Suggestions:
We lose track of the characters as their careers progress. How fitting, in a
way, but I feel we don't know them well enough - especially Nathan. He seems to
disappear. And in a way we don't miss him, maybe because he wasn't there
strongly enough in the beginning. One way to fix this is to have more
"immediate" scenes. A touch of dialogue helps. Another way, perhaps better, is
to give us more about them at the beginning. The rooftop sex scene is nice,
how about some other similar scene that shows who they are in those early days,
that gets us into the heart of each of them? It could be anything. Maybe they
stop at a pet store, look at puppies and kittens and fish. I can imagine them
wanting to pick something out but deciding it wouldn't be practical given their
lifestyle. But no way would they settle for a fish. I can imagine Nathan
saying, "I'll be your puppy if ..." Maybe for a while they make weekly trips
to the pet store, because it makes them happy. That gives us a fuller ground
for Nathan to have picked out the little castle.
The details might be underused a bit. The name Des, for example, seems tossed
in. Nathan uses it, but it's little more than a name. I'd like him to use it
when he makes love to her. And to feel her return to Lucy by the end. The
police, for example, could call her that when they hand her the evidence bag.
Similarly with the little castle - you need to find a way to work it into the
first scene. Having it come in in the middle makes it seem like an extra.
Note I'm not suggesting you clobber us with these details. Just fit them
better into the heart of the story.
On the whole this is an excellent story. My qualms, and they are not major:
the beginning seems a little soft. I'd like a few more scenes of more intimacy
and immediacy.
- Mat Twassel
Mat's Erotic Calendar at http://calendar.atEros.com
From: Selena Jardine
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 10:57:07 -0700
This week in the FishTank we have two authors who have contributed to the FT
before. Both of these stories were written for the Anniversary. The stories
are as different and unique as their author. This second submission is a
complete story by Alexis Siefert. It is 3,760 words in length. A look at
the life of an actress.
FishTank Guidelines apply:
1) 2 positive comments
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
3) Try not to repeat!
This is a wonderful story, with not very far to go before it's really
ready. It's great to see Alexis's talented hand at work. Just a few
comments from me:
Nitpicks:
1) Why does the understudy refer to her as Mona (not getting along
with the cast)? Surely she would know her as Lydia. Mona would be a
nickname for Desdemona, right?
2) I'm not really happy with the phrase "bigger than Dallas." We
have no indication that Nathan's a really big guy, or that she has any
connection with Texas, or anything. It's distracting.
3) The image at the end of Lucy pulling Nathan down with her is too
good to waste. That's what she's been doing all along, hasn't she?
Her problem, her addiction, her tantrums, her consuming interest in
herself, pulling at him. Finally it's too much. I'd punch that up a
little. The disaster seems so sudden, but it's not - it's really the
inevitable outcome. Make sure the reader knows it.
There are a few other small things that winked at me, but that's one
more than I was supposed to mention.
I want to point out that in this story we don't see much of the depths
of Nathan exactly because Lucy is like the actors she describes with
such contempt. She hates them and she is one. She's self-centered
and ambitious and a little bit petty. There's a lot more to her than
that, which is why we can like her, but it's her milieu, and it's why
we only see Nathan through what he can do for her. It's really
beautifully done.
Now for the fun part:
Nice moments:
1) The parents calling and offering a job in the home town is just
perfect. I have friends in show business whose parents do the same
thing. It rings ideally true. Just exactly right.
2) There was a curious tone to the whole story that combined a
weariness with an urgency in the description of Lucy's increasing
thirst. The reason for the weariness becomes obvious at the end of
the story. I really thought the tone was one of the best things about
it. Really nicely done.
From: Mat Twassel
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 19:56:19 GMT
Selena writes:
3) The image at the end of Lucy pulling Nathan down with her is too
good to waste. That's what she's been doing all along, hasn't she?
Her problem, her addiction, her tantrums, her consuming interest in
herself, pulling at him. Finally it's too much. I'd punch that up a
little. The disaster seems so sudden, but it's not - it's really the
inevitable outcome. Make sure the reader knows it.
No, no, no. Make no effort to punch it up. Punching it up would risk losing
it. It's a dim reader indeed who doesn't see what's happening, what has
happened. The understated is almost always stronger. What the reader might
realize despite the narrator is almost always better.
I want to point out that in this story we don't see much of the depths
of Nathan exactly because Lucy is like the actors she describes with
such contempt. She hates them and she is one. She's self-centered
and ambitious and a little bit petty. There's a lot more to her than
that, which is why we can like her, but it's her milieu, and it's why
we only see Nathan through what he can do for her. It's really
beautifully done.
I agree in part; I disagree in part. In two parts, I disagree. The story can
show us Nathan and at the same time show us Lucy's vision of him. It does that
to a degree. It could do it more. The better we see the real Nathan despite
the narrator, the better. Also, isn't there a chance that Lucy changed? That
in her earliest days things were different? I think so. And so there's the
chance to show both Lucy and Nathan in those early days. I see some of
this - the scene on the rooftop, and it's great the way it hints quite strongly
that in fact Nathan isn't enough. Lucy needs her own friction. There's room
for a little more. There's room for Lucy (knowingly or not) to show us that
early Nathan and even to show us how she was herself.
- Mat Twassel
Mat's Erotic Calendar at http://calendar.atEros.com
From: theGreatxIam
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 17:38:20 -0700
This week in the FishTank we have two authors who have contributed to the FT
before. Both of these stories were written for the Anniversary. The stories
are as different and unique as their author. This second submission is a
complete story by Alexis Siefert. It is 3,760 words in length. A look at
the life of an actress.
FishTank Guidelines apply:
1) 2 positive comments
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
3) Try not to repeat!
Good stuff:
1. The bookending of the story with the cocoa is elegantly done, with
just enough of a mention at the top to keep it in the reader's mind
but not so much that one spends the rest of the story wondering how
the cocoa's going to reappear. Would be curious to know how that
evolved - did the writing begin with the idea of using such a device,
or did it crop up during the process and then get worked into a
beginning and ending?
2. The progress of the narrative is strong - no leaping about in
time, a straightforward timeline that's easy to follow. And the
transitions from paragraphs that sweep us through months or years at a
time to long passages narrowing the focus to a specific moment are
seamless.
Stuff that might be tweaked:
1. In a couple of spots, I felt the timeline lurch a little.
One's at the point where Nathan, having disappeared from the
story while Des's career climbs, has to pop back in to save her from
herself.
I started
out doing bit roles. He started out running props. As I
got more lines, he got more jobs. Bigger jobs. Soon he
moved from off the program, to the first listed name under
"Production Management." He was running things.
In order to reinject him, you have to go back over Des's own
history a bit, and his, and it seems to pull us out of the narrative.
A couple of thoughts - either trim back the self-reference there (He
had been rising along with me, getting more jobs, bigger jobs ...) or
make the jump outside the narrative a bit more dramatic with a direct
address to the reader (Oh, yes, I've forgotten to tell you about
Nathan. He had ...)
The other timeline point is near the very end, and it's not about
going backward, but, rather, going forward a bit too fast. I felt
rushed through the death. I look it over and there are several
sentences there; why do I feel rushed? Perhaps because it's all
physical description:
And I
stormed out. I knew he'd follow me. It was the carpet or
the molding or the edge of the step or my anger or my still-
drunk fuzzy vision, but something made the floor slip under
my feet just as I was stepping off the landing onto the
stairs. The wall shifted, and I could see the floor rushing
to hit my face. Nathan caught me around my forearm, but I
was already heading down, and instead of him stopping my
fall, I pulled him down with me.
And we went down. Fast. Sliding over the rough edges of
the stairs to the bottom. I hit the landing on my side.
Bruised and battered. Bloodied but not broken.
Nathan hit the bottom step with his head. The blood
splattered on my arm and chest was his, not mine.
This is the climax of the narrative, and as a reader I want to
linger there a bit. A little look inside her head, perhaps, as she's
falling. Not a life-flashing-before-my-eyes kind of discourse, but a
little something.
2. The story makes good use of variation in sentence lengths, but
there are spots where the short sentences or sentence fragments became
noticeable as a device. I'd just look over those to see if, by
eliminating a few here or there, the overall effect might be
strengthened.
theGreatxIam
From: Uther Pendragon
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 17:23:43 -0600
1 Captures the struggling just-out-of-college life
brilliantly.
2 A well written tragedy.
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
1) Lose "Mona." "Desdemona" is her husband's pet name for her,
and suddenly it shows up in a Variety storry to identify her.
2) The sex scene on the rooftop is hot, but I can't believe you
could manage that much privacy on the rooftop of a New York
walkup building. Not everybody else is going to use the fire
escape all the time.
1 Captures the struggling just-out-of-college life
brilliantly.
2 A well written tragedy.
2) 2 suggestions for improvement
1) Lose "Mona." "Desdemona" is her husband's pet name for her,
and suddenly it shows up in a Variety storry to identify her.
2) The sex scene on the rooftop is hot, but I can't believe you
could manage that much privacy on the rooftop of a New York
walkup building. Not everybody else is going to use the fire
escape all the time.
From: PleaseCain
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 12 Jul 2002 23:39:22 GMT
I always look forward to reading your posts because you are a gifted
storyteller, and this one is no exception. Forget all that other writing stuff
if there is no story attached, and you always show up with one of those. The
beginning and ending make poignant bookends, and the introduction sparks some
nice tension that carries throughout the story: what will happen to one-half of
this loving couple? You also really catch the pressures and bitchiness of
backstage - I know a few people who will truly appreciate the story. I
personally know that first understudy: watch out for her! Good sex, too.
My main suggestion would be to streamline some of the narrative sections, which
moved the story along, but stretch just a bit too long in spots, to where they
seemed like filler between actual scenes. I'm thinking of the section about
her parents, and another about pressure and alcoholism within the acting
profession. Both of these riffs are interesting and contribute to the
development of her character, but I wonder if you could fold in some of that
information elsewhere, because as they stand it sounds like you are
downshifting into a different gear, a different voice, in order to push the
story elsewhere. Almost like we can hear you, the author, thinking.
And those hyphens/colons that a couple others have already pointed out, they
jar, needlessly. There were a few other points of punctuation that caused me
to stumble, but nothing you wouldn't catch on another edit.
But just so you know, you are missing an open-quote in this paragraph:
She said that I was going to have to lose 'Lucy.' Too many
associations-you're not a comedienne. You're not funny.
Don't let it go there."
The first period in the following paragraph should be a comma, right?
So when the bit appeared in the Friday morning trade paper,
a little "we hear that Mona is having difficulty melding
with the supporting cast." I knew where it had come from.
Thank you for kicking in such a unique story.
Cain
From: Desdmona
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 20:02:21 -0400
"> The View From Inside (MF)
By Alexis Siefert
Alexis~
The mood is marvelous. Melancholy from beginning to end. No parts where even
the things that should make her happy, actually make her happy. It's perfect
for the tale. There are some great addictive moments, one so vivid it makes
me angry: "Maybe if he had spoken up earlier. Maybe if he had gotten angry
or if he had called me on it, I might have stopped." She's blaming HIM! I
want to throttle her at this point. It's so true to life. So true of
addicts. Great job!
I'm a sucker for romance, and Nathan's buying the little castle was truly a
moment to make me go, "Ahhhh!" And this passage: "I kept it in my jacket
pocket and wrapped my fingers around the pointed spires whenever the crowds
surrounded me. If Nathan wasn't with me, his castle was there. I hid my
mind in its windows ..." Moving, tear-jerker moving. But I have to say, the
tossing of the castle into the fire at the end was superfluous. The tragedy
of her life and what she had done to Nathan had already been accomplished.
Why take this symbol of who he was, what he was, and destroy it? Why not
keep it with her to remind her of what she had done? Keeping it would be
more difficult, more punishing. And I want her to suffer some guilt. I
imagine an addict who will nearly forget, wash him away without a symbol
around to remind her. Maybe she could toss it and then suddenly realize what
she has done. Imagine her trying to retrieve it from the fire.
I know others have already mentioned Nathan's part in all this, so I just
want to make this one comment. When I read, "As I got more lines, he got
more jobs. Bigger jobs." I thought it made it sound like he only got the
jobs because of her. I wanted desperately to feel like Nathan was more than
that. In fact, I think it's important to make the reader think that Nathan
didn't need her to succeed. He could be successful without her. He's with
her because of love. To think he's with her to further his own career
lessens the tragedy.
And finally, using "Mona" in the Variety paper would be perfect for an
earlier era when articles were vague and innuendo, but in these more modern
times, the tabloids have no qualms about saying exactly who they are talking
about.
I think you've been extremely creative in following the guidelines for the
anniversary. No easy task! But you've accomplished it without seeming forced
or contrite.
Thank you Alexis for giving us this story and for taking the time to
participate and celebrate the anniversary.
Des
From: Alexis Siefert
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 15 Jul 2002 01:08:42 GMT
My goodness! Thank you all. It's encouraging to see the quality of feedback
that shows up in the Tank! I have to say that I think the vast majority of the
suggestions and comments here were spot-on.
A few "cleaning up" comments - the "Mona" reference was a mistake on my part.
I had originally made her stage name "Mona." That elicited a 'give me a
fucking break' from the first person who read it (before I sent it to Des), so
I thought twice, changed it to Lydia, and missed the other reference. Sorry.
Mea Culpa, and thank you all for catching it!
WRT Oosh's semi-colon observations - I happen to be a big fan of semi-colons. I
like the partial-stop that they provide in the pacing, rhythm, and flow of a
story. Perhaps unfortunately, I've gotten out of the habit of using them for
various reasons. It's most likely a factor of remembering to write for
different forums, different readers, and different editors. There is a school
of thought that considers them to be "dated" (or out-dated <G>). When they're
paying for your stories, you write the style that they require. It takes
practice, and sometimes it's hard to shift out of those habits. Thank you for
the reminder that semi-colons don't scare readers J
The hyphens that threw you off started out their lives as emdashes (they were
double-hyphens that were translated to emdashes and then translated back to
single hyphens somewhere in cyberspace). Unfortunately, they didn't translate
to assd correctly. Again, mea culpa. I should have changed them before I
formatted the story for the Fish Tank.
Oosh, the "chimney backing" thing bothered me as well, but I didn't realize
that the word "back" was that prevalent. I went back after reading your
comments and saw it, just like you did. What else do you call the back wall of
a fireplace? Any suggestions?
Many people remarked that they didn't like the ending. That her throwing away
the castle was overdone. You all may very well be right. Des suggested
leaving it undestroyed as a reminder of her folly, of the dangers of
self-indulgence. Throwing it in the fire was an impulsive, reactionary move
made by a self-absorbed woman. One she'll most likely regret. It's a way of
blaming him for dying. But I think that you're all most likely correct. That
needs some rewriting.
Bradley brings up the point of the implausibility of this story being a fault
of (rom) in general. I can't say that I considered this story to be a (rom)
story at all, but I can see the difficulty with the straightforward
presentation of her career advancement. My problem was that I didn't want it
to turn into a story about working her way to the top - that would be another
10,000 words, I think. I was hoping for a brief recitation, something
unemotional and 'there it is.' Numb, more than exciting in the retelling.
Both Bradley and Jeff mention the bitchy, backstabbing world of theatre. I
wasn't trying to deny that part of it, but I think it's something that is
assumed by anyone who has ever seen a "where are they now" special. I didn't
want to belabor it, but perhaps there does need to be more of it.
The other most common 'problem' seemed to be the lack of depth in Nathan's
character. Originally that was intentional. I wasn't writing it as an
omnipotent, all-seeing narrator. It was a retelling strictly from Des' point
of view (thanks for noticing that, Selena!). But in retrospect, perhaps I
overdid it. I wouldn't expect her to 'see' him much once her drinking worked
out of control, but some more of her memories of him in the early days, as Mat
suggested, might help.
GreatxIam pointed out several areas that "jumped." Some of those "spot-on"
comments I mentioned earlier <g> Thanks, and you're right. They both need some
reworking. The death scene works in with Selena's suggestion to bring out the
metaphor of her dragging him down. Both Greatx and Des noticed the problems
with the way Nathan's career was described. It will get reworked.
Okay, now to the sex. The general feeling seems to be that (1) it needs more,
and (2) is it possible to have great sex with some privacy on the roof of a New
York walk up? To respond - (1) Okay. You might be right, but I'm not sure
where to comfortably add more sex. I'll work on it. (2) Yes. Not every
night, but yes. Of course, it depends on the building. When you're on the top
floor, not many people like to take the effort to climb the stairs up to the
roof.
I need to say thank you to several people - Nat did a very good once-over of
this one before I sent it to Des. What made it to the Tank wasn't a first
draft. It was a first rewrite. Denny proofed it for me, and Gary and Shon
were wonderful sounding boards while I was writing it. I wanted to ensure that
the story in the Tank was complete and clean enough to keep the focus on plot
development and character strengths and weaknesses - not on structural problems
that I find in my first drafts.
Oh, and yes, Selena and Nat, "bigger than Dallas" goes. You're right. That
was Alexis, not Lydia, talking <g>.
So, thank you again to everyone who responded. Shon and Uther and Selena, Des,
PleaseCain, GreatxIam. Oosh and Jeff and Mat and Bradley and Tesseract. I'm
honored by the quality of the response and the thought that obviously went into
all of the remarks.
ftp://ftp.asstr.org/pub/Authors/Alexis_S/
http://www.asstr.org/~Alexis_S/
Celebrating the Events of ASSD/ASSM/ASSTR:
http://www.asstr.org/~Alexis_S/HIA_Events.htm
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Comments on The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert.
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From: Shon Richards
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 23:24:20 GMT
"Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:[email protected] ...
Postive #Uno->I was 25, and I had three names. Fuck. No wonder I started
I just love that line. It has emotional weight behind it and its funny.
Postive#Dos- Most ingenious use of a fishtank in an anniversary story. That fishtank means something and I screamed at the ending.
Negative#Uno- She burned the damn fishtank! Maybe I'm a sentimental fart, but I didn't understand why. It was like she was killing every bit she had of him.
Negative#Dos-It was a wonderful story about acting, the pressures of acting and alcohol addiction, but where was the sex? We need more sex! Heck, I beleive in Nate and Des, let's get it on :)
Shon Richards
A good portion of my stories can be found at my never-finished website at http://www.asstr.org/~ShonRichards/ All of them can be found through ftp at http://www.asstr.org/files/Authors/ShonRichards/
From: oosh
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Tue, 9 Jul 2002 01:59:14 +0000 (UTC)
Two such accomplished stories in one week! To criticize either seems an impudence. And this one appears far more polished than any first draft of mine that I can remember!
I'm embarrassed to start with something so trivial, but perhaps both my "points to improve" are embarrassingly trivial, and I hope that will be taken as a compliment.
Seeing a dash written as a hyphen-just like this-is to me a big stumbling block. I read "hyphen-just" and "this-is" as groups. Maybe typographers don't surround dashes by spaces; but in a plain text medium, I honestly think we should. Every time I saw a dash, I stumbled and got distracted.
Second on points to reconsider, if not exactly to "improve": I felt that this piece had excellent sentence rhythm, and the choice of words was generally irreproachable. But I did feel that it was strait-jacketed by its avoidance of colons or semi-colons. I don't at all object to full stops/periods being used instead of lesser stops on occcasion, but for me, their over-use is jolting. Colons and semi-colons can give the same spacing without nailing the pace so much. Of course, when one is used to reading a fuller vocabulary of punctuation, it is harder to accord to the full stop/period the do-it-all function that others would have it supply, so perhaps my sensibilities and good taste have been fried by too much inferior prose.
Finally on the (too many) things to improve, the brick "backing" of the fire. This was a good and helpful image. Everything here worked, but I felt that the word "backing" was too weak. "Chimney-back" or "hearth- back" might be better. Having seen this and picked up on it, I then noticed that the word "back" occurred twice more in close proximity. That's a devil, when it happens. I wonder if there's anything that can be done to reduce those three successive backs. It's the kind of thing that gives me nightmares, because I know from my own painful experience how often that kind of thing happens. Maybe I'm being over-sensitive.
The positives are much more significant for me. I was full of admiration for the way the author built the character of the narrator and insinuated her doubts and fears. It was a really gripping and convincing tale, and one that kept me completely involved and interested. While the ending could be called melodramatic - and if I'd written this tale (or been able to write it) I'm sure I'd have flagellated myself endlessly about it - I truly think that the whole level of emotional intensity supports it and made it convincing for me. Nothing less would really answer the emotional demands of the story. And those demands were convincingly made. I thought that to put across a drama of this depth in so short a compass was a remarkable achievement.
I also felt that the sexual element was beautifully proportioned to the subject. It was done in a way that I found both grateful and graceful in itself, and also that highlighted and clarified the characters involved.
I think I came away with more points to improve for myself than for anyone else! I much admired it.
O.
From: Jeff Zephyr
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Mon, 08 Jul 2002 21:51:55 -0600
On Mon, 8 Jul 2002 07:49:25 -0400, "Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote:
I liked how the tale explored the inside of Lucy's fall into addiction. It didn't define her life, but it certainly had a major impact, in more ways than just the ending.
I'd comment on the 3 names line. But that is taken. Instead, the whole "actor's life" excuse-making is quite well done. It isn't quite true, BTW. It is the same sort of scenery as the beer for the factory workers at the bar or picnic, or any adult party pretty much. Some people, without being either children or recovering, deal with it better.
But if Lucy was one of those, we would have a different story. So her take on her situation is a perfect inside view, her inability to see the problem and let things go feels "right." Makes me wish that I could be there to help her out, if there was a way to fix things better.
I'd wish for a different ending. I get what happens, and it hurts to read about it. The whole tale is like that, I think, but it does get to a point where I'm really glad it wasn't longer. There'd be more pain, more feeling of loss if the hot, happy sex and love went on more.
Still, a 2nd for the wish to make a bit more to the sex parts. The whole romance has a nice edgey sexiness to it suggested, yet it seems to fall into the cracks between the work and drinking problems. Somehow, I just don't think they got married just for love, nor for just close interests. No, the opening seems to set up a soft romantic side to things, and the "on the rooftop" stuff seems the design of an active, maybe even obsessive love life.
Makes me wonder where that went, when they weren't together so much. Was she missing it? More, how unhappy was Nathan over the whole situation?
I know, it is her view and not his, but maybe a glimpse, a bit more of his disappointment (he seems so calm, but I can't see him hiding all of it, nor her missing all of it).
Jeff
Web site at http://www.asstr.org/~jeffzephyr/ For FTP, ftp://ftp.asstr.org/pub/Authors/jeffzephyr/
There is nothing more important than petting the cat.
From: Bradley Stoke
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 9 Jul 2002 04:37:11 -0700
Alexis
A touching story of love, loss, fame and failure. One which kept a focus on its essential motif of cocoa, alcohol and mutual support.
There was a lot to like about the story, but as other critics will have their own favourites, I'll concentrate on just two things (as I don't want to again be accused of diverging from the FishTank Guidelines).
My first praise would be for the way the story manages to bring together the elements of Lydia's relationship with Nathan in a plausible way in a life which demand a change in his essential role: from being a student lover, through being a supportive husband, a concerned manager and, finally, someone who sacrifices everything (perhaps not intentionally) to help Lydia's declining career.
I also liked the sensual way in which scenes of sex and love were drawn together and flowed naturally from the rest of the story. It wasn't forced and it brought some very cozy images to my mind. Wrapped in a blanket, fucking on a lawn chair, cocoa in front of a fire - surely no woman could want for a better partner than Nathan? (Although what does the saintly Nathan get out of this? Do people like him really walk the Earth? Or do they descend on wings and serve only to bring broad grins to the already over-stretched faces of Whoopi Goldberg and Robin Williams?).
However, my biggest gripe, but I've no idea how it can be improved, is the plausibility of it all. Maybe this is "rom" fiction and maybe this comfortable world of saintly husbands. Of a thespian career with so few tantrums and only the slightest hint of a drink problem. Where only one understudy and not an army of them are working to undermine Lydia's career. Where a woman can somehow avoid even a hint of infidelity when that is almost the norm in the world she inhabits. And where a career in Broadway sounds as straightforward as a career in Accountancy. Perhaps in the world of "Rom", all this is possible and real and at the end it all works out so well that only exceptional circumstances like a badly judged fall down the stairs will really bring tragedy. I think my problem is that all I know of the catty, bitchy, deceitful and ruthless world of the stage is merely hinted at here. It reads to me like someone in "Hello" magazine confessing to a life that went wrong (for a nice fat fee), who has taken full advantage of her right to edit the final text. But perhaps I just misunderstand the genre, and reality as I understand it gets only a small look-in.
My other suggestion of what to improve. I don't know. It's a well-structured, well-written, well proof-read story. Only plausibility and credibility mar it in my mind (and I might just be very cynical). I guess it might have been good to get more of the physical sense of what it was like for Lydia to be an actress, and not just a wife whose job was on Broadway. Perhaps some more mention of the intrusiveness of the press, a sense of the agony of first-night nerves, some extra evidence that Lydia's life was one really spent in the City of New York (where the poodles are so small, the restaurants are so crowded and the elevators take so long to arrive) and real evidence that Lydia did really have a drink problem.
Well done. A very well written story.
Bradley Stoke
For More : http://www.asstr.org/~Bradley_Stoke
From: Tesseract
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 9 Jul 2002 23:10:43 -0700
"Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]> ...
It's a very poignant story, and reminiscent of "Days of Wine and Roses". I think you show the slide into addiction very well and you keep the melancholy mood going through to the end. I wasn't happy with the ending, but it was necessary. It was fitting that he died because of her.
You got the technical stuff - spelling, grammar - right. But I would expect that. Except for the hypens/dashes. I believe the common typographic convention is to use two hypens: - , if the character set you're using doesn't have a proper dash.
<aside>
About semicolons. I assume you are the product of a North American education, as I am.
I was told about semcolons so that I would recognize one when I saw it, and had some idea about its function. But I wasn't given much instruction in actually using them. Actually, I am quite upset about much of my high school English instruction. It really neglected formal grammar. <\aside>
I have a bit of a problem with this section:
It doesn't really say why she walked off the stage. What was the triggering event? If it was the actions of the previous paragraph, why would she walk onto the stage in the first place, instead of sulking in her dressing room?
But that's just nit-picking. Overall I think it' a good story.
Tesseract
From: Mat Twassel
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 15:41:43 GMT
Strengths:
The sweeping narrative flow - telling a longish history without getting bogged down, covering ground and keeping it interesting.
The selection of details - from funny pairing of names: Lucy & Des, to the fish tank castle. It's so neat that she didn't know she didn't have it, and that it didn't burn in the fire.
Suggestions:
We lose track of the characters as their careers progress. How fitting, in a way, but I feel we don't know them well enough - especially Nathan. He seems to disappear. And in a way we don't miss him, maybe because he wasn't there strongly enough in the beginning. One way to fix this is to have more "immediate" scenes. A touch of dialogue helps. Another way, perhaps better, is to give us more about them at the beginning. The rooftop sex scene is nice, how about some other similar scene that shows who they are in those early days, that gets us into the heart of each of them? It could be anything. Maybe they stop at a pet store, look at puppies and kittens and fish. I can imagine them wanting to pick something out but deciding it wouldn't be practical given their lifestyle. But no way would they settle for a fish. I can imagine Nathan saying, "I'll be your puppy if ..." Maybe for a while they make weekly trips to the pet store, because it makes them happy. That gives us a fuller ground for Nathan to have picked out the little castle.
The details might be underused a bit. The name Des, for example, seems tossed in. Nathan uses it, but it's little more than a name. I'd like him to use it when he makes love to her. And to feel her return to Lucy by the end. The police, for example, could call her that when they hand her the evidence bag. Similarly with the little castle - you need to find a way to work it into the first scene. Having it come in in the middle makes it seem like an extra. Note I'm not suggesting you clobber us with these details. Just fit them better into the heart of the story.
On the whole this is an excellent story. My qualms, and they are not major: the beginning seems a little soft. I'd like a few more scenes of more intimacy and immediacy.
- Mat Twassel
Mat's Erotic Calendar at http://calendar.atEros.com
From: Selena Jardine
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 10:57:07 -0700
"Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]> ...
This is a wonderful story, with not very far to go before it's really ready. It's great to see Alexis's talented hand at work. Just a few comments from me:
Nitpicks:
1) Why does the understudy refer to her as Mona (not getting along with the cast)? Surely she would know her as Lydia. Mona would be a nickname for Desdemona, right?
2) I'm not really happy with the phrase "bigger than Dallas." We have no indication that Nathan's a really big guy, or that she has any connection with Texas, or anything. It's distracting.
3) The image at the end of Lucy pulling Nathan down with her is too good to waste. That's what she's been doing all along, hasn't she? Her problem, her addiction, her tantrums, her consuming interest in herself, pulling at him. Finally it's too much. I'd punch that up a little. The disaster seems so sudden, but it's not - it's really the inevitable outcome. Make sure the reader knows it.
There are a few other small things that winked at me, but that's one more than I was supposed to mention.
I want to point out that in this story we don't see much of the depths of Nathan exactly because Lucy is like the actors she describes with such contempt. She hates them and she is one. She's self-centered and ambitious and a little bit petty. There's a lot more to her than that, which is why we can like her, but it's her milieu, and it's why we only see Nathan through what he can do for her. It's really beautifully done.
Now for the fun part:
Nice moments:
1) The parents calling and offering a job in the home town is just perfect. I have friends in show business whose parents do the same thing. It rings ideally true. Just exactly right.
2) There was a curious tone to the whole story that combined a weariness with an urgency in the description of Lucy's increasing thirst. The reason for the weariness becomes obvious at the end of the story. I really thought the tone was one of the best things about it. Really nicely done.
3) Great ending line. Very powerful.
Thanks for letting us read this, Alexis!
Selena
[email protected]
From: Mat Twassel
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 19:56:19 GMT
Selena writes:
No, no, no. Make no effort to punch it up. Punching it up would risk losing it. It's a dim reader indeed who doesn't see what's happening, what has happened. The understated is almost always stronger. What the reader might realize despite the narrator is almost always better.
I agree in part; I disagree in part. In two parts, I disagree. The story can show us Nathan and at the same time show us Lucy's vision of him. It does that to a degree. It could do it more. The better we see the real Nathan despite the narrator, the better. Also, isn't there a chance that Lucy changed? That in her earliest days things were different? I think so. And so there's the chance to show both Lucy and Nathan in those early days. I see some of this - the scene on the rooftop, and it's great the way it hints quite strongly that in fact Nathan isn't enough. Lucy needs her own friction. There's room for a little more. There's room for Lucy (knowingly or not) to show us that early Nathan and even to show us how she was herself.
- Mat Twassel
Mat's Erotic Calendar at http://calendar.atEros.com
From: theGreatxIam
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 17:38:20 -0700
"Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]> ...
Good stuff:
1. The bookending of the story with the cocoa is elegantly done, with just enough of a mention at the top to keep it in the reader's mind but not so much that one spends the rest of the story wondering how the cocoa's going to reappear. Would be curious to know how that evolved - did the writing begin with the idea of using such a device, or did it crop up during the process and then get worked into a beginning and ending?
2. The progress of the narrative is strong - no leaping about in time, a straightforward timeline that's easy to follow. And the transitions from paragraphs that sweep us through months or years at a time to long passages narrowing the focus to a specific moment are seamless.
Stuff that might be tweaked:
1. In a couple of spots, I felt the timeline lurch a little.
One's at the point where Nathan, having disappeared from the story while Des's career climbs, has to pop back in to save her from herself.
In order to reinject him, you have to go back over Des's own history a bit, and his, and it seems to pull us out of the narrative. A couple of thoughts - either trim back the self-reference there (He had been rising along with me, getting more jobs, bigger jobs ...) or make the jump outside the narrative a bit more dramatic with a direct address to the reader (Oh, yes, I've forgotten to tell you about Nathan. He had ...)
The other timeline point is near the very end, and it's not about going backward, but, rather, going forward a bit too fast. I felt rushed through the death. I look it over and there are several sentences there; why do I feel rushed? Perhaps because it's all physical description:
This is the climax of the narrative, and as a reader I want to linger there a bit. A little look inside her head, perhaps, as she's falling. Not a life-flashing-before-my-eyes kind of discourse, but a little something.
2. The story makes good use of variation in sentence lengths, but there are spots where the short sentences or sentence fragments became noticeable as a device. I'd just look over those to see if, by eliminating a few here or there, the overall effect might be strengthened.
theGreatxIam
From: Uther Pendragon
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 10 Jul 2002 17:23:43 -0600
"Desdmona" <[email protected]> wrote:
1 Captures the struggling just-out-of-college life brilliantly.
2 A well written tragedy.
1) Lose "Mona." "Desdemona" is her husband's pet name for her, and suddenly it shows up in a Variety storry to identify her.
2) The sex scene on the rooftop is hot, but I can't believe you could manage that much privacy on the rooftop of a New York walkup building. Not everybody else is going to use the fire escape all the time.
Uther Pendragon FAQs http://www.nyx.net/~anon584c [email protected] fiqshn http://www.asstr.org/~Uther_Pendragon
From: Uther Pendragon
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 11 Jul 2002 15:45:12 -0600
This has not been received at my "home" ISP. Please forgive me if it a duplicate on yours.
From: "Desdmona" <[email protected]>
1 Captures the struggling just-out-of-college life brilliantly.
2 A well written tragedy.
1) Lose "Mona." "Desdemona" is her husband's pet name for her, and suddenly it shows up in a Variety storry to identify her.
2) The sex scene on the rooftop is hot, but I can't believe you could manage that much privacy on the rooftop of a New York walkup building. Not everybody else is going to use the fire escape all the time.
Uther Pendragon FAQs http://www.nyx.net/~anon584c [email protected] fiqshn http://www.asstr.org/~Uther_Pendragon
From: PleaseCain
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 12 Jul 2002 23:39:22 GMT
I always look forward to reading your posts because you are a gifted storyteller, and this one is no exception. Forget all that other writing stuff if there is no story attached, and you always show up with one of those. The beginning and ending make poignant bookends, and the introduction sparks some nice tension that carries throughout the story: what will happen to one-half of this loving couple? You also really catch the pressures and bitchiness of backstage - I know a few people who will truly appreciate the story. I personally know that first understudy: watch out for her! Good sex, too.
My main suggestion would be to streamline some of the narrative sections, which moved the story along, but stretch just a bit too long in spots, to where they seemed like filler between actual scenes. I'm thinking of the section about her parents, and another about pressure and alcoholism within the acting profession. Both of these riffs are interesting and contribute to the development of her character, but I wonder if you could fold in some of that information elsewhere, because as they stand it sounds like you are downshifting into a different gear, a different voice, in order to push the story elsewhere. Almost like we can hear you, the author, thinking.
And those hyphens/colons that a couple others have already pointed out, they jar, needlessly. There were a few other points of punctuation that caused me to stumble, but nothing you wouldn't catch on another edit.
But just so you know, you are missing an open-quote in this paragraph:
She said that I was going to have to lose 'Lucy.' Too many associations-you're not a comedienne. You're not funny. Don't let it go there."
The first period in the following paragraph should be a comma, right?
So when the bit appeared in the Friday morning trade paper, a little "we hear that Mona is having difficulty melding with the supporting cast." I knew where it had come from.
Thank you for kicking in such a unique story.
Cain
From: Desdmona
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: Sat, 13 Jul 2002 20:02:21 -0400
"> The View From Inside (MF)
Alexis~
The mood is marvelous. Melancholy from beginning to end. No parts where even the things that should make her happy, actually make her happy. It's perfect for the tale. There are some great addictive moments, one so vivid it makes me angry: "Maybe if he had spoken up earlier. Maybe if he had gotten angry or if he had called me on it, I might have stopped." She's blaming HIM! I want to throttle her at this point. It's so true to life. So true of addicts. Great job!
I'm a sucker for romance, and Nathan's buying the little castle was truly a moment to make me go, "Ahhhh!" And this passage: "I kept it in my jacket pocket and wrapped my fingers around the pointed spires whenever the crowds surrounded me. If Nathan wasn't with me, his castle was there. I hid my mind in its windows ..." Moving, tear-jerker moving. But I have to say, the tossing of the castle into the fire at the end was superfluous. The tragedy of her life and what she had done to Nathan had already been accomplished. Why take this symbol of who he was, what he was, and destroy it? Why not keep it with her to remind her of what she had done? Keeping it would be more difficult, more punishing. And I want her to suffer some guilt. I imagine an addict who will nearly forget, wash him away without a symbol around to remind her. Maybe she could toss it and then suddenly realize what she has done. Imagine her trying to retrieve it from the fire.
I know others have already mentioned Nathan's part in all this, so I just want to make this one comment. When I read, "As I got more lines, he got more jobs. Bigger jobs." I thought it made it sound like he only got the jobs because of her. I wanted desperately to feel like Nathan was more than that. In fact, I think it's important to make the reader think that Nathan didn't need her to succeed. He could be successful without her. He's with her because of love. To think he's with her to further his own career lessens the tragedy.
And finally, using "Mona" in the Variety paper would be perfect for an earlier era when articles were vague and innuendo, but in these more modern times, the tabloids have no qualms about saying exactly who they are talking about.
I think you've been extremely creative in following the guidelines for the anniversary. No easy task! But you've accomplished it without seeming forced or contrite.
Thank you Alexis for giving us this story and for taking the time to participate and celebrate the anniversary.
Des
From: Alexis Siefert
Re: The View From Inside, by Alexis Siefert
Date: 15 Jul 2002 01:08:42 GMT
My goodness! Thank you all. It's encouraging to see the quality of feedback that shows up in the Tank! I have to say that I think the vast majority of the suggestions and comments here were spot-on.
A few "cleaning up" comments - the "Mona" reference was a mistake on my part. I had originally made her stage name "Mona." That elicited a 'give me a fucking break' from the first person who read it (before I sent it to Des), so I thought twice, changed it to Lydia, and missed the other reference. Sorry. Mea Culpa, and thank you all for catching it!
WRT Oosh's semi-colon observations - I happen to be a big fan of semi-colons. I like the partial-stop that they provide in the pacing, rhythm, and flow of a story. Perhaps unfortunately, I've gotten out of the habit of using them for various reasons. It's most likely a factor of remembering to write for different forums, different readers, and different editors. There is a school of thought that considers them to be "dated" (or out-dated <G>). When they're paying for your stories, you write the style that they require. It takes practice, and sometimes it's hard to shift out of those habits. Thank you for the reminder that semi-colons don't scare readers J
The hyphens that threw you off started out their lives as emdashes (they were double-hyphens that were translated to emdashes and then translated back to single hyphens somewhere in cyberspace). Unfortunately, they didn't translate to assd correctly. Again, mea culpa. I should have changed them before I formatted the story for the Fish Tank.
Oosh, the "chimney backing" thing bothered me as well, but I didn't realize that the word "back" was that prevalent. I went back after reading your comments and saw it, just like you did. What else do you call the back wall of a fireplace? Any suggestions?
Many people remarked that they didn't like the ending. That her throwing away the castle was overdone. You all may very well be right. Des suggested leaving it undestroyed as a reminder of her folly, of the dangers of self-indulgence. Throwing it in the fire was an impulsive, reactionary move made by a self-absorbed woman. One she'll most likely regret. It's a way of blaming him for dying. But I think that you're all most likely correct. That needs some rewriting.
Bradley brings up the point of the implausibility of this story being a fault of (rom) in general. I can't say that I considered this story to be a (rom) story at all, but I can see the difficulty with the straightforward presentation of her career advancement. My problem was that I didn't want it to turn into a story about working her way to the top - that would be another 10,000 words, I think. I was hoping for a brief recitation, something unemotional and 'there it is.' Numb, more than exciting in the retelling. Both Bradley and Jeff mention the bitchy, backstabbing world of theatre. I wasn't trying to deny that part of it, but I think it's something that is assumed by anyone who has ever seen a "where are they now" special. I didn't want to belabor it, but perhaps there does need to be more of it.
The other most common 'problem' seemed to be the lack of depth in Nathan's character. Originally that was intentional. I wasn't writing it as an omnipotent, all-seeing narrator. It was a retelling strictly from Des' point of view (thanks for noticing that, Selena!). But in retrospect, perhaps I overdid it. I wouldn't expect her to 'see' him much once her drinking worked out of control, but some more of her memories of him in the early days, as Mat suggested, might help.
GreatxIam pointed out several areas that "jumped." Some of those "spot-on" comments I mentioned earlier <g> Thanks, and you're right. They both need some reworking. The death scene works in with Selena's suggestion to bring out the metaphor of her dragging him down. Both Greatx and Des noticed the problems with the way Nathan's career was described. It will get reworked.
Okay, now to the sex. The general feeling seems to be that (1) it needs more, and (2) is it possible to have great sex with some privacy on the roof of a New York walk up? To respond - (1) Okay. You might be right, but I'm not sure where to comfortably add more sex. I'll work on it. (2) Yes. Not every night, but yes. Of course, it depends on the building. When you're on the top floor, not many people like to take the effort to climb the stairs up to the roof.
I need to say thank you to several people - Nat did a very good once-over of this one before I sent it to Des. What made it to the Tank wasn't a first draft. It was a first rewrite. Denny proofed it for me, and Gary and Shon were wonderful sounding boards while I was writing it. I wanted to ensure that the story in the Tank was complete and clean enough to keep the focus on plot development and character strengths and weaknesses - not on structural problems that I find in my first drafts.
Oh, and yes, Selena and Nat, "bigger than Dallas" goes. You're right. That was Alexis, not Lydia, talking <g>.
So, thank you again to everyone who responded. Shon and Uther and Selena, Des, PleaseCain, GreatxIam. Oosh and Jeff and Mat and Bradley and Tesseract. I'm honored by the quality of the response and the thought that obviously went into all of the remarks.
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